In a recent conversation with a Philadelphia detective, I mentioned Prince of the City, a fine police drama directed by Sidney Lumet.
The detective, who is much younger than I, did not
know about the 1981 film, or the true story of the late Robert Leuci (seen in
the above and below photos).
Back in 2009, I interviewed Robert Leuci, the subject of the
film and Robert Daley’s true crime book.
You can read my Crime Beat column on Robert
Leuci below:
Robert Leuci, the former New York City detective who was the subject of the book and film Prince of the City, is a crime writer who lives in Rhode Island, far from the mean streets of New York City.
Robert Daley’s Prince of the City: The True Story of a Cop Who Knew Too Much, was a first-rate true crime book and Sidney Lumet’s film based on the book with Treat Williams portraying Leuci when he was a young detective, and a member of the elite narcotics Special Investigating Unit (SIU), was brilliant and haunting.
Leuci, as he recounts in his memoir All the Centurions:
A New York Cop Remembers His Years On the Street - 1961-1981 (Harper),
committed acts of corruption, but he came forward and volunteered to make cases
for the prosecutors (including a young Rudolph Giuliani) against corruption in
the criminal justice system.
He was not, he stresses, caught in a criminal act and forced to
do so, which is the path taken by so many crooked cops and assorted criminals.
And he says he was not an oddball and outcast like Frank
Serpico, the NYPD undercover narcotics cop who was the subject of both the book
and film Serpico. Leuci said he was all cop. He belonged.
He wanted to go after corrupt lawyers, political fixers and
judges, but tragically for Leuci; he was ultimately forced by prosecutors to
also testify against his former partners and other cops.
Leuci, now 68, retired from the NYPD in 1981. In addition to his memoir, he writes crime novels.
I contacted Leuci and talked to him about drugs, organized crime, crime fiction, and his life as a cop and a writer. Below is my Q&A with him:
Davis: I read two of your
novels, Odessa Beach and Captain Butterfly and
I read your memoir All the Centurions. I thought they were very
good.
Leuci: Odessa
Beach and Captain Butterfly are my early books. My
later books are much better.
Davis: I’ll have to read
them as well.
Leuci: My favorite is Fence
Jumpers. It’s a bit autobiographical. For Odessa Beach I
spent about nine months at Brighten Beach among the Russian immigrants. That
was fun.
Davis: Was that as a
detective or later as a writer?
Leuci: It was after I
retired. I wanted to write something about these Russian immigrants, whom I
found fascinating. I lived down there and wrote the book. Russian guys have
been around since 1979. They left the old Soviet Union and were allegedly going
to Israel, but they never got there. They are mostly Jews, but they were not
Jewish in any sense. They knew nothing about Judaism and they knew nothing
about Karl Marx. They were not communists, they were just Russians. They were
tough guys. A lot of them were ex-prisoners who had been in jail for all sorts
of different reasons. The first wave that first came here were some of the
toughest guys you would want to meet. They are very violent and they are into
almost everything. They are much more powerful today than the Italians.
Davis: Have the Russians
become the bigger organized crime element in the country?
Leuci: For a hundred years,
Italian organized crime held sway in the streets in all the big cities,
especially in eastern cities, and some in the west. New York alone had five
major crime families. They were all over the place and they controlled drugs,
gambling, prostitution, and a lot of stuff. But they’re done, pretty much.
Davis: Italian organized
crime is still active around the country, including here in Philadelphia – I’m
part-Italian and I live in South Philly - but you’re right, their influence has
greatly diminished.
Leuci: I know a lot of
people like to say that organized crime kept crime down, and without organized
crime, disorganized crime would take over the streets, but these guys were
responsible for most of the drugs that were in the streets. They were
responsible for a lot of that street crime. I write about this in Fence
Jumpers.
Davis: Have you written
about anything other than crime?
Leuci: No, I’ve thought
about it, but crime is what I know.
Davis: I find crime to be
one of the most interesting of human endeavors.
Leuci: There can be a lot
of really good things in a crime novel.
Davis: I truly liked Prince
of the City, both the book and the film. Were the book and film accurate?
Is there anything that you would change if you could?
Leuci: I had a certain
amount of input there, but not a whole lot. The book was written by Bob Daley,
who is a wonderful writer and a good friend, and then it was turned into a film
by Sidney Lumet, who is a wonderful film director who made Serpico and Network and
other wonderful movies.
But you know it was not exactly an uplifting movie. I’ve never
sat through the entire movie, but I saw bits and pieces of it - it’s too hard
for me. People still say to me why did you do this? What was the reason? It’s
not really explained very well in the book, and it’s not explained at all in
the movie. I mean it sort of gives you an idea of why I got involved in that
investigation, but it was hard to do it, I suppose. In All the
Centurions, I really do explain what brought me to that place and why I did
what I did. I’m not sure it was a great decision, by the way.
Davis: That’s my next
question. Do you think you did the right thing by coming forward?
Leuci: Certainly, at the
time. I was probably on the verge of a nervous breakdown, and I didn’t even
realize it. I was a bit loony and all kinds of things were going on in my life.
I was very depressed about the work I was doing in the police department. I went
into the police department because I very much wanted to be a cop.
I found myself within a short period of time, after five or six
years, behaving in ways that were foreign to my nature. I was behaving in ways
that were much like the people I was investigating. It made me sick, and it
started to make me crazy. The people I cared most about were the other cops I
worked with, and most of them were great guys, but they were crooks. We all
rationalize our behavior. It made sense to me at the time, but when I really
thought about it and really took it all apart, I realized it was so
hypocritical and so opposed to anything I believed in. I should have quit or
transferred to another unit, but I didn’t do that and I got caught up in this
crazy investigation that was a horror in many ways. It was a decision that
changed my life certainly, and maybe changed it for the better in some ways,
but the price I paid and the price that other people paid for my fucking
feeling sorry for myself, was way too high.
Davis: Are there different
levels of corruption? Is there a difference between a cop taking a meal and a
cop taking drug money?
Leuci: For years many cops
believed there was “clean money” like gambling, and “dirty money” like drugs,
but the problem with that kind of mentality is that most of the money really
comes out of drugs. It ends up in one big circle. I would never sell drugs. I
would never sell to an informant. I had a line that said I would never cross. A
lot of guys I worked with said they would never cross that line, but a lot of
guys did. You can’t draw those lines; it’s beyond your control. You shouldn’t
do that. Once you do it you’ve screwed yourself. It’s a sensual world you’re
working in. It really rubs off on you. There is no cop born, ever, that changed
the street. But the street has changed every single cop.
Davis: Drugs are rampant
today, and they fuel many other crimes. Can you tell us what it was like to a
narcotics detective in your day in New York?
Leuci: There was a heroin
epidemic in the 1960s, 1970s, and part of the 1980s. The drug of choice was
heroin, not cocaine or crack cocaine. Heroin killed thousands of drug addicts.
The 60s and the 70s were a crazy time, and when you added this drug, it made the
whole world seem topsy-turvy. But there was less violence as that drug doesn’t
produce violence. People go out and rob to get the drug, but heroin is an
opiate. It makes people tired, it makes them sleep. Heroin addicts are not
threatening people. When the drug of choice changed to crack cocaine it became
extremely violent. That drug produces violence and paranoia. Meth is another
violent drug.
Davis: I’ve long been
interested in your era, as I was a young guy then, and I read Robin
Moore’s The French Connection in 1969 and went on to read a
lot of books and see a lot of films about crime in New York, including Prince
of the City, and your books. In your era the SIU produced many legendary
detectives like Eddie Egan, Sonny Grosso, and Joe Nunziata. Nunziata was an
interesting man who came to a tragic end with his suicide. Even though he was
apparently corrupt, my heart went out to him and his family when I saw Prince
of the City.
Leuci: Joe Nunziata looked
like Dean Martin. He was a very handsome, a very gregarious guy. He was all
those things. There were a lot of good things about him, and I was one of his
big admirers. Joe made some big mistakes. We all did. I think the film did him
justice. I talk to his son every now and again. Papa's Game is
a great book that tells the story of that time and the French Connection
rip-off. That was the most horrendous thing imaginable.
Davis: Yes, after
confiscating all that heroin in the French Connection case, the biggest drug
bust at the time, someone simply stole it from the NYPD property room. Did you
know the people written about in Papa's Game, the criminal Vincent
Papa and Detective Frank King?
Leuci: I knew Frank King
pretty well. Frank King was a good cop in a lot of ways, but he was thoroughly
corrupt. He was a gangster as a cop.
Davis: How are you
treated by law enforcement officers today?
Leuci: It depends on where
they are and who they are, what generation they are from. I lecture at every
police department in the country, with the exception of New York, on
corruption, ethics and morality. The cops are very nice. But what old school
guys say, and it’s true, is that you violated something that can’t be forgiven.
When you turn in a cop for whatever reason, it’s unforgivable. I understand it
as I come from that generation. That has changed nowadays. It exists in cases
of police brutality, but I think that if there is a cop out there who is going
off on his own and doing corrupt things, other cops will report it. Police
today have different kinds of education, background and world views. I don’t
think you can get away with that kind of stuff today.
Davis: I have one last
question about your era. Did you see the film American Gangster? It
has been reported that the corrupt detective was based on you.
Leuci: I won’t go see it. I
read the magazine piece and this guy has got to be kidding. Josh Brolin called
me up and said he was playing me in a movie. I said you’re not playing me.
Davis: Did you know the
Black heroin dealers Frank Lucas or Nicky Barnes?
Leuci: I never worked in
Harlem, and I didn’t know Lucas. I worked in Brooklyn.
Davis: I talked to a
retired DEA agent who worked in New York at the time, and he said the movie was
false and Lucas is a liar. Lucas never did any of that stuff he claimed. When
he was caught, he ratted out his gang and family members, but he never made any
cases against corrupt cops or DEA agents. The writers and filmmakers naively
believed everything Lucas told them.
Leuci: The people who wrote
that spent no time doing any kind of research on it. They had this great story
and they turned it into a movie. This guy Jacobson, who wrote the magazine
piece and wrote the screenplay, is totally full of shit. I had federal protection
during the time he was talking about. I know the detective he was talking
about, a guy named Albano. He was a real bad guy who worked Harlem. He was
involved with the French Connection case. But if they didn’t spend any time
trying to get it straight, if they didn’t get my story straight, how can they
get the rest of that movie straight?
Davis: Do you think Lucas
used your name because you are known?
Leuci: Yes, of course. My
daughter wanted to sue, but I said no.
Davis: They didn’t use your
name, but they used your street name “Babyface.”
Leuci: No, when he gives
Lucas his card, that’s my name on it.
Davis: I didn’t catch that.
Leuci: I’ve never seen it,
but people told me about it. I was working for Giuliani at the Southern
District of New York, and if any of that was true, Giuliani would have
crucified me. Those guys should be ashamed of themselves. It’s all
bullshit.
Davis: One of the things I
liked in your memoir was your portrayal of Sean Connery, one of my favorite
actors. You wrote that at a party people were smoking pot and Connery told them
to respect you and stop. “This man is a police officer.” I can hear his commanding
voice.
Leuci: Sean Connery is a
very straight shooter. He was very kind to me when I was out of my level in
Hollywood with these characters. He was very supportive. Some guys started
smoking pot in front of us and he got pissed off.
Davis: Who influenced you
as a writer?
Leuci: Robert Stone is a
big influence, and he is my mentor. I like Joseph Wambaugh, Dennis Lehane,
Richard Price. There are so many writers that I really like.
Davis: Any last
thoughts?
Leuci: I’ve written seven books, taught at the University of Rhode Island for ten years, and I’ve lectured around the world. I’m a much more complicated character than you see in the movie.
Note: Below are photos of Treat Williams from the 1981 film Prince of the City.
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